Why I want to meet Ken Wilber

I’ve been listening to Ken Wilbur’s Kosmic Consciousness on SoundsTrue the last couple of days, and am trying to sort out levels and lines.

This isn’t what he wanted me to get out of it at all, if he wants anything out of expressing his views, but here goes.

It is my understanding that a spirit can be limited by the vessel it finds itself under some circumstances. It says something important about my unrealistic expectations that everyone can evolve. Some just can’t, they don’t have the proper structures for it. I just have to figure out exactly what that all means in terms of “human potential.” Can it be true that large numbers of humans don’t have the potential for enlightenment? When do we accept that we’ve gone as far as we can? Isn’t it a sort of surrender to settle into complacence, when we can’t know whether we’ve hit the “glass ceiling”, vs. whether we are merely at a plateau?

It also comes back to a previous conversation I had about animal intelligence. Some animals may happen to have brain structures that give them better reasoning skills, or the higher emotions, or perhaps an unusual capacity for understanding human language. Imagine owning a veritable Da Vinci among dogs. Would he get bored easily?

It convinces me all over again that intelligence is a continuum. All types, even the ones where I personally have severe deficiencies.

While humans are unmistakeably at the top of the food chain, it is likely that there are animals that are more highly evolved in other lines. For instance, can you conceptualize a chair as a pattern of echoes rather than as a visual construct? Can you describe a chair by duplicating the sound reflections off that chair?


Comments

waywrdsun
Juneau

couldn't help myself

You should subscribe to www.integralnaked.org if you haven’t already.

Levels and lines—“Lines” refer to lines of development. There are a number of them including cognitive, physical, spiritual, musical, mathematical… you can see just about anything that one may develop as a line of development. “Levels” simply refers to what level a person is at along a particular line. A popular way of measuring levels in the integral community is using the Spiral Dynamics model put forth by Don Beck and Christopher Cowen and based on Clare Graves’ work.

I recommend A Brief History of Everything as a good introduction to Wilber’s work.

I disagree with the idea that not everyone can evolve (I assume you’re equating evolving with developing). I believe that everyone is capable of developing. Some may not reach high levels within a lifetime, but that does not mean they can’t develop from where they are now. Some lines of development need to lead the pack so to speak. Often there must be cognitive development before other lines may be developed… that is to say that cognitive development is necessary but not sufficient for some other lines of development. It is also true that when we lack development along some lines, it causes a drag (so to speak) on the whole system, and so it may be necessary to do work on that area in order to facilitate further growth as a whole.
Cheers!

banth57
Big Comfortable Chair From Which I Can Rule The Galaxy

Thanks for the comment

I ordered A Brief History of Everything last week – then came across your comment here. I guess I’m on the right line, but I’m not going up the levels as quickly as I’d hoped.
Still.
As I read my thoughts and your comment several months later, I realize that the wetware limits us in certain lines, but that we will still progress easily in the lines that suit us best. The other lines take work, and it’s up to each individual to decide where to devote the most time and energy. Am I on the right track?


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